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Bob
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Joined: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 1288
Location: Neartown Houston
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 Posted: Sun Jun 19, 2005 1:17 pm Post subject: Expanding the Harris Cty toll road system |
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KTRH reporter Brent Fuller reported Monday that Harris County released the new five-year Capital Improvement Plan on Friday morning, which identifies county construction projects for fiscal years 2005-06 through 2009-10. The plan identifies $2.16 billion of Toll Road Authority projects; however, the director [Art Storey] highlights "five feasible projects that should be the next ones to be considered."
| Quote: | 1. Beltway East Mainlanes. Wilber Smith Associates will be requested to update a traffic and revenue study and provide an investment grade level analysis for the project. An agreement with the Texas Department of Transportation will also be required.
2. Brazoria County Toll Road. This project would connect the City of Alivin to SH 288 south of Pearland and continue on SH 288 to a point inside IH 610, and potentially to US 59. An investment grade study and agreements with Brazoria County and the Texas Department of Transportation will be needed.
3. Grand Parkway, Segment E. This project, which is almost ready for final design and right of way acquisition, will require an investment grade analysis and an agreement with TxDOT.
4. Hardy Toll Road Extension. The road would be extended from IH 610 to downtown. Final design is underway. A projection of traffic and revenue will be prepared along with an agreement with TxDOT. Subject to the state, connections by the Hardy Extension are to be made with the Elysian Viaduct into downtown and southbound to US 59.
5. Hempstead Road Managed Lanes. The lanes would go from Jones Road to IH 10. An investment grade study will be needed along with an agreement with TxDOT. The agreement would include standards and timing for the state's improvements to US 290.
In addition to the above five projects, the director shows two other projects that could become priorities. One would be the second phase of the Fort Bend Connector from US 90A along Post Oak Boulevard to the IH 610 Loop. Phase one is from SH 6 to US 90A near Chimney Rock. The director said the second phase project will be evaluated as to its feasibility and community impact. Projected traffic and revenue appear to be sufficient to cover the debt to accomplish the project. The state would need to approve the connection into IH 610.
A second potential project for the priority list could be the Fairmont Parkway/Red Bluff Tollway from SH 146 to Beltway 8. Additional traffic and revenue data will be needed for evaluation with investment grade studies. A part of the evaluation will included the impact of truck traffic from the Port of Houston's Bayport terminal. |
Correspondingly, the Harris Cty Commissioners' Court agenda for Tuesday, June 21, 2005 includes approving the necessary traffic and revenue studies for the projects:
| Quote: | c. Toll Road Authority
1. Recommendation that the County Judge be authorized to execute agreements or amendments, and for appropriate officials to take necessary actions to complete the transactions with:
a. Fort Bend County for joint construction, maintenance, and operation of the Fort Bend Westpark extension toll road in the amount of $372,525 for toll collection system software and related equipment.
b. Dannebaum Engineering Corporation for engineering services for the Hardy Toll Road extension into downtown, allowing for new maximum rates for services performed after July 1.
c. Wilbur Smith Associates, Inc., for supplemental services in the amount of $192,295 for a preliminary traffic and revenue study for five potential new tollway facilities and a comprehensive finance-grade traffic and revenue study of the existing and expanded tollway system.
d. Fort Bend County for joint construction, maintenance, and operation of the Fort Bend Parkway Toll Road, allowing for Harris County to provide routine maintenance on the Parkway.
See the entire Commissioners' Court agenda online at http://www.co.harris.tx.us/agenda/2005/0512ag.pdf |
So I wonder... are the affected communities aware these projects are coming? Will HCTRA hold public meetings in each community before final design concludes? How will citizens ensure -- before construction begins -- they will benefit from sound walls, greenscaping, drainage, etc.?
Last edited by Bob on Mon Jun 20, 2005 8:14 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Ed Browne
CDL & OTR Black Belt
Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 1304
Location: Spring Branch
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| Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 9:01 am Post subject: Re: Expanding the Harris Cty toll road system |
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| Bob wrote: |
5. Hempstead Road Managed Lanes. The lanes would go from Jones Road to IH 10. An investment grade study will be needed along with an agreement with TxDOT. The agreement would include standards and timing for the state's improvements to US 290. |
This one is particularly important given Metro's commuter rail proposal because the two projects may be vying for some of the same land - the UP railroad ROW. |
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Bob
Site Admin
Joined: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 1288
Location: Neartown Houston
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| Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 1:54 pm Post subject: |
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CTC has now confirmed that:
- On Fri June 17, Harris County released the new 5-year Capital Improvement Plan (CIP) which identifies the next 5-7 priority toll road corridors. The document is available on paper at the county office downtown but is not available online, save for the excerpts I entered in the previous post.
- On Tues June 21, Harris County commissioners are expected to approve the plan at the only scheduled public hearing -- Tues June 21 at 9:00 am in the Commissioners' Court chambers at 1001 Preston, 9th floor, Houston, 77002.
- Commissioners are then expected to vote at the 10:00 am Commissioners' Court meeting to authorize $192,295 for traffic and feasibility studies for the new priority toll roads.
This four-day process is remarkably fast and opaque with no public notice and little mention by the press. When and where was the public supposed to learn about the new toll road corridors or participate in the planning process?!?
If you care about toll road accountability, please call both your Harris County Commissioner and the Harris County Judge today and let them know that the public deserves notice and a meaningful opportunity to review these plans and weigh in. This 4-day process is way too fast and precludes real public participation.
Precinct 1 Commissioner El Franco Lee (713) 755-6111
Precinct 2 Commissioner Sylvia Garcia (713) 755-6220
Precinct 3 Commissioner Steve Radack (713) 755-6306
Precinct 4 Commissioner Jerry Eversole (713) 755-6444
County Judge Robert Eckels (713) 755-4000
CTC will take neighborhood leaders to the CIP hearing and Commissioners' Court meeting on Tuesday morning. If you are available to come downtown Tuesday morning from 9:00 - 11:00 am, please contact Robin rholzer@ctchouston.org or Polly pledvina@ctchouston.org ASAP. |
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christof
Site Admin
Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 702
Location: Downtown
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| Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 4:29 pm Post subject: Re: Expanding the Harris Cty toll road system |
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| Ed Browne wrote: |
This one is particularly important given Metro's commuter rail proposal because the two projects may be vying for some of the same land - the UP railroad ROW. |
The 290 MIS indicates that sufficient ROW is available for both managed lanes and rail transit in the 290 corridor. That doesn't mean this isn't worth watching- but it doesn't have to be an either/or issue. It's the pro-highway politicians - Radack, Eckels, Culberson - who have pushed the 290 commuter rail idea the most, and its inclusion in the METRO plan may indicate they really want it.
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CynicusPrime
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Joined: 20 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 5:28 pm Post subject: |
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Harris County has a Capital Improvement Plan for FY04/05-08/09 already approved here: http://www.eng.hctx.net/hcpid%20cip%202004.pdf
So why do they need another one before that one expires? Or do I just know nothing about municipal government?
CynicusPrime. |
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Bob
Site Admin
Joined: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 1288
Location: Neartown Houston
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| Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 10:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Harris County and the City of Houston both prepare their Capital Improvement Plans (CIPs) on a rolling basis. Each year, some projects are completed and removed, and other new projects are included. However, it's important to note that new projects aren't necessarily scheduled for the end of the 5-year planning cycle. The county may act immediately on projects in the new CIP. The FY05/06-09/10 CIP prioritizes the next 5-7 toll road projects -- some of which we haven''t heard of until now -- and the Commissioners are scheduled to vote tomorrow to fund traffic and feasibility studies for these projects. |
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Bob
Site Admin
Joined: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 1288
Location: Neartown Houston
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| Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 10:46 pm Post subject: |
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| It looks like the County has made the new CIP document available online (sometime after 3:00 pm today), along with the agenda for Tuesday's 9:00 am hearing, as a 43kb PDF. |
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Bear
Moderator
Joined: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 118
Location: Inner Loop
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| Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 8:21 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Toll Road Authority. The estimated cost of the five-year plan for toll roads is $2.16 billion. Current projects that are near completion are the Westpark Tollway, the Fort Bend Toll Road Connector, and lane widening for the Sam Houston Tollway from US 59 South to I-45 North. Engineering work is underway for the Hardy Extension Downtown, Beltway 8 East, and lane widening for Sam Houston Tollway South. |
Does anybody know how much the soon to be completed projects comprise of the $2.2BB? |
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Morgan
Class C License
Joined: 20 Jun 2005
Posts: 18
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| Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 12:50 pm Post subject: Commissioners Court Meeting June 21, 2005 |
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This was my first time at the Commissioners Court.
It seems that from the Commissioners point of view any toll road that has the potential to make money for the County is a good toll road. Does any revenue from toll roads go to the County's general fund or is 100% dedicated to the care and feeding of toll roads?
If investment in toll roads generate revenue for the County then I would be surprised if the Commissioners would be behind any comprehensive planning that would threaten that investment (i.e. light rail). If one were to overlay the light rail scheme on the toll road scheme, what would it look like?
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Bob
Site Admin
Joined: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 1288
Location: Neartown Houston
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| Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 1:52 pm Post subject: Re: Commissioners Court Meeting June 21, 2005 |
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| Morgan wrote: | | This was my first time at the Commissioners Court. |
Thanks to you and the other folks who came! I heard from a number of folks who placed calls to the Judge and Commissioners' offices today and yesterday, so I believe we were more "present" than was readily visible.
We had a fantastic press turnout and calls/interviews today, so look/listen for us on the news tonight and tomorrow:
- Radio: 740-KTRH, 88.7-KUHF
- TV: KPRC-2, KHOU-11, and TWC-16 Municipal Channel
- Papers: Chronicle, Examiner, Rumbo, and another I missed the name of
Here's the KUHF coverage (with click-to-listen): http://www.publicbroadcasting.net/kuhf/news.newsmain?action=article&ARTICLE_ID=786777
Here's the KHOU coverage (with click-to-watch): http://www.khou.com/topstories/stories/khou050621_gj_tollroads.314ede19.html
Here's the Chronicle's article: http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/metropolitan/3235709
The entire Commissioners' Court meeting (we're up in the first 10 minutes) will air on TWC-16 (the Municipal Channel) on Wednesday night at 7:00 pm.
Last edited by Bob on Wed Jun 22, 2005 2:37 pm; edited 4 times in total |
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Bob
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Location: Neartown Houston
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| Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 1:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Morgan wrote: | | Does any revenue from toll roads go to the County's general fund or is 100% dedicated to the care and feeding of toll roads? |
I don't know for sure (anyone?). But I do know that at the Texas Transportation Commission meeting in January, Harris County Judge Robert Eckels tried to convince Polly, me, Ed, and others that it's important to "pool" together all the possible tollroad corridors -- including the "won't happen" lines through the Heights and Memorial Park -- because that way the county can spend toll revenue to build things we want like bike paths there.
| Morgan wrote: | | If one were to overlay the light rail scheme on the toll road scheme, what would it look like? |
I'm defering to Christof, Ed, or one of our other rail-savvy folks on that one! |
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christof
Site Admin
Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 702
Location: Downtown
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| Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 4:22 pm Post subject: |
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| Bob wrote: |
| Morgan wrote: | | If one were to overlay the light rail scheme on the toll road scheme, what would it look like? |
I'm defering to Christof, Ed, or one of our other rail-savvy folks on that one! |
The METRO light rail plans are concentrated inside the Loop, so the proposed light rail lines (which are designed to serve inner neighbrohoods) serve a different travel market than the proposed toll roads (which are generally designed to serve suburban areas). The major exception is METRO's North/Hardy line, which would extend as far as Intercontinental Airport, paralleling the Hardy Toll Road and the proposed Managed Lanes on I-45.
Practically speaking, I don't think the county views light rail as competition in terms of patronage. However, many of the politicians backing the toll roads may see light rail as competition for funding - if METRO were not building light rail, it could be putting that money into Managed Lanes or other highway projects.
Various commuter rail plans, however, do duplicate toll road plans. The 290 corridor, where HCTRA proposed Managed Lanes and METRO proposes commuter rail, is a prime example. Here the county commissioners - our local lords of toll roads, and vocal light rail opponents -- have been talking up commuter rail. There may be more of an urban/suburban split here than a modal disagreement.
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Christof Spieler |
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connie
Learner's Permit
Joined: 21 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 6:51 pm Post subject: Grand Parkway Segment F-2? |
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(from the CIP)
"b. Toll Road Traffic and Revenue Studies.
Wilbur Smith Associates is nearing completion of a preliminary traffic and revenue study for five potential new tollway facilities. These projects from the “pooled projects” program are identified on the attached drawing showing existing and proposed tollways. Also attached is a map and listing of the “pooled projects”. Engineering work will begin this year on Grand Parkway (SH 99), Segment E (IH-10 to US 290). Studies continue for Grand Parkway Segments F (US 290 to IH-45N) and G (IH-45N to US-59N). The funding projections attached include about $430 million for construction of Grand Parkway segments, assuming final approval of those projects will be forthcoming."
I wonder what this means............ |
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pledvina
Class C License
Joined: 26 May 2005
Posts: 8
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| Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 4:06 am Post subject: Re: Commissioners Court Meeting June 21, 2005 |
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| Morgan wrote: | | This was my first time at the Commissioners Court. |
Public comments are definitely a lot more rare at commissioners court than at city hall. Generally I've found that Judge Eckels will give you "special treatment' and try to flatter you and the Commissioners will all just ignore you. No matter, the best you usually hope for from these visits is good coverage by the press. By that measure, our visit was successful.
Our pleas of "hold public meetings" and "listen/talk to the public" and " give us a better process" are sort of like little flies buzzing around the ears of the commissioners - annoying, but easy to swat away. To accomplish anything with them, I think we need to very quickly move on to voice specific concerns.
I guess I'm saying that if the Commissioners won't bring the town hall meeting to the neighborhoods, the neighborhoods should bring the town hall meeting to the commissioners. What do you think would happen if routinely at every commissioners court meeting 4 or 5 people presented their questions and concerns about specific toll roads planned for their neighborhood? Would we start to get better answers about these projects? Could we influence their designs or assessments of "feasibility"?
Residents in established communities have an advantage over residents in the yet to be developed communites which new toll roads are intended to serve. We exist, they don't. We can go to court meetings, they can't. We have a voice, they don't. We should use our voice to make sure that quality of life in existing neighborhoods is not sacrificed for a gleam in any developers eye.
I think a lot of meetings are being held over concerns about new roads but for some reason we tend to involve our council members but spare our commissioners. Let's stop sparing them. |
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neeag
Learner's Permit
Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 1
Location: Houston, TX
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| Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 9:00 am Post subject: Question |
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Can I start a petition and present it at the fourm meeting? Also is there anyone willing to volunteer to help with going in neighborhoods in the 290 area?? I am only one person and if anyone would like to help I would appreciate it.
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If you don't take a stand for one thing, you'll fall for anything. |
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LevinC
Bus Driver
Joined: 13 May 2005
Posts: 26
Location: SW Houston/Westbury/Bellaire
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| Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2005 3:49 pm Post subject: Art Storey @ County Commissioner's Court |
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Robin, Polly & all that attended the CC meeting,
On Sunday afternoon, my husband stumbled upon the video of the CC mtg right when Robin was making her last comments to the court. I watched & listened to Art Storey's "rebuttal" with extreme concentration and skepticism.
It was only after his little speech was over that something I BELIEVE he said really sank in. Did he HONESTLY say, "We can't schedule/hold a meeting on something that we don't know will be built until we know it will be built." ??!?!?!?!?!?
If that quote is even remotely accurate, wouldn't that then mean that WE wouldn't have notice and/or a public meeting until THEY KNOW THEY'RE GOING TO BUILD IT? In which case, there's NO turning back!!
Please, if anyone can confirm or deny that statement I would greatly appreciate it!!! Robin, I know you have the video and you watched it again w/The Examiner reporter. Do you recall his statement?
It was a remarkably confusing statement, that further justifies the communities' confusion regarding the lack of information and unwillingness to involve the public in discussing the options that are being considered and allowing us to submit/share OUR ideas in the development stages!!!
Last edited by LevinC on Sun Jul 03, 2005 6:40 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Bob
Site Admin
Joined: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 1288
Location: Neartown Houston
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| Posted: Tue Jul 05, 2005 2:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Good point! I'll take a look at the tape for Storey's comments... |
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Ed Browne
CDL & OTR Black Belt
Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 1304
Location: Spring Branch
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| Posted: Tue Jul 05, 2005 10:50 pm Post subject: Re: Art Storey @ County Commissioner's Court |
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| LevinC wrote: | Robin, Polly & all that attended the CC meeting,
Did he HONESTLY say, "We can't schedule/hold a meeting on something that we don't know will be built until we know it will be built." ??!?!?!?!?!?
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It's interesting that I am so used to public meetings being held after the decision has been made, that I really had trouble grasping the subtlety of your argument.
We listened to it a number of times tonight and in context what he said makes sense. He was talking about Fort Bend Toll road terminating into 610 and that he would need TXDoT approval before HCTRA could connect the toll road to 610. He would have the public meetings only when he knew the road could connect. He expressed a concern about looking foolish talking about something that couldn't happen yet!!
Regardless, he could hold public meetings as soon as he knows where he will put the toll road. Knowing where the road will go doesn't require that the timetable be set and I believe that you're right -- having public meetings when you know the toll road can connect implies that it will connect -- so the public meetings are little more than lip service.
For meaningful public input, the public needs to be able have some effect on the outcome. This is clearly something that TXDoT, HCTRA, Metro and others don't seem to grasp. Judge Eckels spoke about the lack of public input when he holds public meetings -- his example was that of 40000 mailings, he only had 4 people attend the public meeting -- but the public seems to understand the process better than he does. Why attend a meeting when there is no possible public input?! In other words, the public cannot affect the outcome.
I asked around a bit and no one from our group -- all very tuned to transportation issues -- seems to be on Judge Eckels' mailing list -- or any other commisioner's list for that matter. One wonders who is. |
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Bear
Moderator
Joined: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 118
Location: Inner Loop
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| Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:31 am Post subject: |
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| christof wrote: | | The METRO light rail plans are concentrated inside the Loop, so the proposed light rail lines (which are designed to serve inner neighbrohoods) serve a different travel market than the proposed toll roads (which are generally designed to serve suburban areas). The major exception is METRO's North/Hardy line, which would extend as far as Intercontinental Airport, paralleling the Hardy Toll Road and the proposed Managed Lanes on I-45. |
The extension of the Hardy into downtown is something that a lot of business leaders have been requesting, and Continental Airlines has been begging, for quite a while. The idea being to a) facilitate travel between downtown and the airport during prime commue hours, and b) to finally link The Woodlands directly into downtown. Yes, this will probably kill the neighborhood around the Elysian Viaduct, but my understanding is that there is a lot more support for this particular extension than for almost any other toll road project (much beyond just a suburban base).
Fair disclosure: extending the Hardy to downtown will benefit me greatly projecting my current commuting patterns out three years. |
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LevinC
Bus Driver
Joined: 13 May 2005
Posts: 26
Location: SW Houston/Westbury/Bellaire
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| Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 7:10 pm Post subject: Long spewage of my opinions & ending w/SB62 |
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I am totally in favor of light rail, toll roads, street widening and overall improvements in our transportation plights, as long as WE ARE MADE AWARE OF THE PLANS AND ALLOWED TO BE INVOLVED WITH OR VOTE ON THE PLANNING & DEVELOPMENT.
After the fact, behind our backs and being lied to is absolutely UNACCEPTABLE!!!!!!
Beltway 8 was a Godsend to those of us on the outskirts of the city, but the West loop of BW8 is now worthless because of the current construction to:
1) replace the bad concrete the ignoramus contractor used when they built it,
2) widen it because they didn't realize how many people would utilize it, 3) massive congestion because of the ignorance of #2 (3 lanes of BW8 + 3 lanes from 59 merging into only 2 lanes), and,
4) FINALLY finish the Westpark Toll Road intersections that were halted almost a year ago because HCTRA wasn't paying the contractor (who upped the price tag because of unexpected problems due to the initial inadequate construction)!!
I love my EZ Tag and do NOT intend to give it up, but I think there are some SERIOUS planning and development problems that MUST BE considered before "they" start building those things all over our counties and through our neighborhoods!!! I honestly think they absolutely, positively have only one thing in mind. Can you guess? Money. Plain and simple.
That is wrong! Their constituents should be their #1 concern and I truly do not think we are even a factor in their considerations!
How can we be involved w/the planning and development stages of the county toll roads when the County Judge, Cty Commissioners, even the Governor are all blindly behind tolling because they're reaping the monetary/political benefits AND they (conveniently) don't have to tell anyone anything?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
Sorry, I guess I kinda went off there. As you can tell, I'm upset with the fact that these things are happening without our knowledge and living with the horrific traffic from past mistakes of HCTRA. I am not thrilled with the run-around (lip service as Ed called it) that the CTC and citizens continue to receive when we try to voice our concerns...exactly as they tell us to do.
OK -- so we've gone to Commissioner's Court (2+), we've gone to City Council, we went to Austin, gotten the media involved...we have done all the things that Radack, Eckels, Storey, etc. have continually told us to do, but the last thing they say to do, which I'm primed and ready for, is to "VOTE THEM OUT OF OFFICE"!
Now, how do we get the County Judge out of office?
WAIT! I have an even better question! What are the chances that we can get Janek to amend his special session SB62 (regarding the Supreme Court's eminent domain ruling) to include an additional entity...the COUNTY?!?!?
I just reread the article in the Chronicle and it states that bill is on Monday's agenda. Oh well. Kinky for Governor! |
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kf5nd
Bus Driver
Joined: 11 Jul 2005
Posts: 966
Location: Copperfield, FM529 & Barker-Cypress
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| Posted: Sat Jul 16, 2005 2:47 pm Post subject: Hempstead Highway toll lanes indented to meet Grand Parkway |
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From a letter I received from Director Strech, HCTRA, dated July 14, 2005
"The proposed (Hempstead Highway) toll road will connect I-10 to the Grand Parkway in its ultimate configuration. However, Phase I will only be constructed from I-10 to SH 6, at most. For your information, the Grand Parkway is currently planned to cross SH 290 between Mason and Bauer Roads." |
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LevinC
Bus Driver
Joined: 13 May 2005
Posts: 26
Location: SW Houston/Westbury/Bellaire
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| Posted: Wed Aug 03, 2005 10:55 pm Post subject: Article from West U Examiner |
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Hopefully the following link is usable. This is an article from The West U Examiner about last week's victory at County Commissioner's Court!
http://www.westuexaminer.com |
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kf5nd
Bus Driver
Joined: 11 Jul 2005
Posts: 966
Location: Copperfield, FM529 & Barker-Cypress
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| Posted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 8:33 am Post subject: On Commissioner's Court Agenda, 4/8/08 |
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WHAT ON EARTH IS THIS???
| Harris County Commissioners' Court agenda wrote: | d. Toll Road Authority
a. Protiviti, Inc., for professional services in the amount of $575,000 for business risk identification and internal control improvements. |
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kf5nd
Bus Driver
Joined: 11 Jul 2005
Posts: 966
Location: Copperfield, FM529 & Barker-Cypress
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| Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 1:40 pm Post subject: |
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Peter Key called to tell me that this is a large, complex IT project concerning their computerized credit-card processing operations which must keep going 24/7. So in that context, $575,000 sounds "in the ballpark", based on how much IT consulting costs these days (thousands per day).
I was satisfied with the answer. |
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